Home

What elevator do I have?

Posted By: mjz3348

What elevator do I have? - 11/07/19 07:19 PM

I have a residential elevator which stopped working. Error code reported by the controller (in attic) shows: "open car safety circuit" & "There is a fault, floor = 0".
I checked the first floors door lock and it seems fine. Cleaning the contacts and rebooting (power re-start) of the system does not change anything. The elevator will not go into "re-learn" mode so I can set the floors.

I have no idea what elevator or control board this is from - Can someone suggest where I can get a manual? My elevator company is not avialable for awhile so I am hoping to debug.

Control Board

Posted By: workingclass

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/07/19 08:48 PM

Please don’t try to troubleshoot
You are not trained
People can die.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/07/19 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by workingclass
Please don’t try to troubleshoot
You are not trained
People can die.


No one is going to die. I am just trying to understand what the likely culprit is from the experts on this forum. I am very technical.

The installation company (not available) gave me instructions years ago on how to reset the elevator if it loses its "floor" memory. I followed the instructions and the elevator doesn't respond.
Power is on, lights in the cab are working. I am not going to "do anything".

Based on the link - can someone at least tell me what brand/ model I have?
Posted By: Indirtwetrust

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/08/19 01:41 AM

The board in the picture says Conquest
Posted By: elmcannic

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/08/19 02:41 AM

The “likely culprit” is what the read out display says, and no “reset” is going to cure that.

If your elevator company is “not available for a while” (?), I’d suggest calling another. Preferably a licensed elevator/conveyance contractor.
Posted By: workingclass

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/08/19 03:06 AM

You’re playing with door locks
If you don’t even know what controller you’re working on, I’d say this is best left to someone who knows what they are doing
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/08/19 08:47 PM

Originally Posted by Indirtwetrust
The board in the picture says Conquest


Thanks - I see it is Conquest 15152 control board.
I am waiting on a service visit. Hopefully they can fix this.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/19/19 12:59 AM

Update:

The elevator technician finally arrived today and the problem was a broken O-ring which surrounds a metal counting wheel. The rubber portion rides along a guide rail turning the wheel. He replaced the entire wheel/O-ring with a new solid rubberized wheel (no O-ring) and the elevator was running again.

When the O-ring broke, the elevator lost floor count (two floors) and stopped at the upper limit. The tech manually dropped the elevator by bypassing that switch and then put the elevator into 'learn' mode with new wheel in place. He reconnected the by-passed switch and the elevator is running.

A new problem, however, is that the door lock clicks lock and unlock every 5 minutes or so and the cab light pops on. It does this on both floors. I have no idea what is causing this, but the elevator does work. To stop the door lock/unlock clicking sound and the lights staying on, I have to kill power to the elevator.
Posted By: tayto

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/19/19 04:20 PM

garaventa bought quest over a decade ago. they actually have a change up for the encoder "o-ring" that is a molded polyurethane roller (red). is your elevator hydraulic or traction? i assume traction...
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/19/19 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by tayto
garaventa bought quest over a decade ago. they actually have a change up for the encoder "o-ring" that is a molded polyurethane roller (red). is your elevator hydraulic or traction? i assume traction...


The technician replaced the o-ring with the 'red' polyurethane roller you described above. The elevator I believe is traction. It has steel cables connected to counterweights. Very slim design. I wonder if I can get schematics from Garaventa?

Once the technician disabled/bypassed the upper limit switch, he was able to lower the cab to be level with the second floor. From there, he re-connected the UL switch and put the unit into learn mode which was successful. The elevator would then operate normally up and down. Leaving the elevator at the second floor however, about an hour later, on its own, it moved up a few inches, showed "3" on the display and locked out (upper limit switch hit). I can't fathom why it would do this.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/20/19 06:10 PM

I learned today that the weights weigh more than the cab when the cab is empty. So the elevator if not "locked" in place would tend to drift upward and the weights move downward. It seems as if the elevator is not 'locking' in place for very long.

Is this a control board problem likely (electronic) or a mechanical problem (brake or locking mechanism)?

I am asking because this elevator (Garaventa bought Conquest) is not sold anymore and circuit boards may be impossible to get. I'm hoping I have a mechanical issue that can be fixed easily by any technician.
Posted By: elmcannic

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/20/19 08:10 PM

I don’t believe this to be an “electrical” board type issue. Your observations of drifting upwards should be conveyed to the tech when he comes out again at your request. Seems this latest issue was not evident with the initial visit by the tech, but rather manifested itself later, as are the door close clicking/lights on and off scenarios. With your best accurate descriptions, when he returns, tell him.
Good luck sir.
Posted By: RustyIron

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/21/19 01:40 AM

MJZ,
"Drifting up" is very serious. One a scale of 1 to 10, I'd put it somewhere between 9 and 10. Call a qualified technician to fix this problem immediately. Don't let your wife or kids near that elevator. If I was called to look at an elevator with the symptoms you describe, I wouldn't ride it myself until the problem was resolved.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/21/19 05:48 PM

thanks Elmcannic and RustyIron - hopefully I can get someone to fix this.

As this is a Conquest traction elevator which was bought by Garaventa, no one seems to know where to get info (including Garaventa) (i.e. schematics, etc.) let alone parts. I am waiting on Garaventa to call me back with recommendations.

At this stage, I am just curious what "locks" an elevator in place once it reaches a floor. When the elevator is on the first floor, every 15 minutes or so, you can hear the motor run for a split second and then the door unlocks (lights come on). After a few minutes the lights go out (looking through the peephole). 15 or so minutes later, same thing occurs again. What I am surmising (door is closed and I can't see) is the cab is moving slowly upward losing the "floor" and the electronics detects this and moves the elevator back in position triggering the door lock and lights. I'm just guessing on this. When I was in the elevator during the re-learn process, the elevator never moves once it reached the floor. Maybe my own weight and the tech was enough to keep it in place. On the second floor, movement upwards would run into the upper limit switch locking the whole system out. And so now I wait again for a tech.

Strange behavior.
Posted By: elmcannic

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/21/19 06:29 PM

mjz,

You seem a pretty observant person, and those observations most likely declare what the issue is. I don’t believe, although I could be wrong, and I know you’re curious...anyone here is going to tell you directly what they believe the issue most likely is, let alone the “how’s” to fix the “why’s.
You’ll most likely learn a bit more when the tech come out again.

Oh- very daring of you to be in the cabin during the “learn run” process! If you have a moment, read the discussion titled, “Discuss Close Call” and you’ll quickly understand just how dangerous our trade can be. Riding in the cab during a “learn run”? I would not recommend it.
Posted By: Swanniejack

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/21/19 06:37 PM

Please just isolate the elevator and wait for an expert, as they say, a little knowledge is dangerous!!
Posted By: Indirtwetrust

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/21/19 06:52 PM

Are you sure this is a traction elevator? It sounds to me like it’s a roped hydro that is leaking down and re-leveling.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/22/19 12:03 AM

It has counterweights and steel cables.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/22/19 12:05 AM

Originally Posted by elmcannic
mjz,

You seem a pretty observant person, and those observations most likely declare what the issue is. I don’t believe, although I could be wrong, and I know you’re curious...anyone here is going to tell you directly what they believe the issue most likely is, let alone the “how’s” to fix the “why’s.
You’ll most likely learn a bit more when the tech come out again.

Oh- very daring of you to be in the cabin during the “learn run” process! If you have a moment, read the discussion titled, “Discuss Close Call” and you’ll quickly understand just how dangerous our trade can be. Riding in the cab during a “learn run”? I would not recommend it.


It's a residential elevator - two floors. Even if it fell from the second floor to the first - I have jumped that height. It's not a big deal. I just want it fixed.
Posted By: Rev1

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/22/19 02:18 AM

I know you're a do it yourselfer, but that shouldn't pertain to elevator systems. It's not just the fall hazard, it's the unknowns and unexpected when you're not familiar with the possible dangers. Complacency or over confidence has injured or even killed some of the elite. If it's truly a 2 stop traction that's drifting????? I would leave it to someone that knows what they are doing!
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/22/19 04:12 PM

Originally Posted by Rev1
I know you're a do it yourselfer, but that shouldn't pertain to elevator systems. It's not just the fall hazard, it's the unknowns and unexpected when you're not familiar with the possible dangers. Complacency or over confidence has injured or even killed some of the elite. If it's truly a 2 stop traction that's drifting????? I would leave it to someone that knows what they are doing!


I don't know if its "drifting" per se. Just that after it stops at the second floor and I get out as per normal - some time later when I return to it, the elevator has moved up about six inches and triggered the upper limit.

The issue for me is Garaventa is so far washing their hands of it (acquired Conquest, but no longer care about their prior installed systems). Several elevator companies I called (Houston) don't work on this elevator or can otherwise help. So I am in a bind.
Posted By: Johnny

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/23/19 07:26 AM

Where is the motor located? Can you post a picture of the motor and the brake?
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/23/19 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by Johnny
Where is the motor located? Can you post a picture of the motor and the brake?


The motor assembly is right next to the cab driving the steel cables. I can see it easily when I take the wood panel off exposing the track, cable, motor and LED control panel. I'll take a picture and post.

Again - I'm not going to "do anything" - but if someone on this forum can spot something obvious, I might be able to get a tech out who can fix it. I can't help but feel it's something simple since the elevator basically works (when not bumping up against the upper limit).
Posted By: workingclass

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/24/19 11:37 AM

Why not just get a “tech” out who can fix it right now, and not bother with this nonsense?
Posted By: elmcannic

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/24/19 10:05 PM

The OP reports he’s had a tech out once, but is now experiencing difficulty in getting a follow up response. It appears he’s contacted other area companies, but they don’t want to have anything to do with his residential unit. So, it’s not for lack of trying to overcome “this nonsense”.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/24/19 11:02 PM

Originally Posted by elmcannic
The OP reports he’s had a tech out once, but is now experiencing difficulty in getting a follow up response. It appears he’s contacted other area companies, but they don’t want to have anything to do with his residential unit. So, it’s not for lack of trying to overcome “this nonsense”.


Absolutely true. The company who designed the space and installed the elevator no longer can support. The elevator manufacturer referred me to another company who told me they don't work on these elevators. It seems I have a "lemon" that cost me over $40,000. I am getting angry that this is a one time sale and then you are on your own.
Posted By: workingclass

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/24/19 11:39 PM

Where are you located
Posted By: tayto

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/25/19 07:18 AM

Conquest was acquired by Garaventa in 2008, this is how they got into the residential elevator market. I'm sure they supported the product until old stock was used up. This is pretty standard when elevator businesses get bought. Having worked for Garaventa at the start of my career I always found it funny when home owners feel like they got the short end of the stick. Would you spend 40k on a car and never change the oil or brakes or tires? Probably not. Yet when it comes to their elevator it should just work all the time with no maintenance. Anyway, I'm sure you will be able to find someone in your area that has experience with these units. As far as boards go I'm sure they can be repaired at places like World Electronics, etc. Garaventa for whatever ever reason didn't keep the traction elevators, I seem to remember Thyssen ended up "stealing" it somehow and then shutdown their residential line some years ago. I could be remembering wrong though.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/26/19 03:02 AM

I think we have a fix. One of the original techs who installed the elevator (now works for a commercial firm) came out and quickly had the elevator running again by bypassing the upper limit switch and resetting the floors ("learn mode"). He then waited in the elevator for 15 minutes to track the door lock click open/close - which it never did. He left the elevator and we chatted outside the door and within a few minutes the door clicked open which he heard.

We decided the cab is not balanced properly and has too much counter weight (so the cab is constantly pushing upward triggering the brake loss). So I loaded the cab with 50 pounds and the elevator has not clicked open or get stuck above the second floor since. He suggests putting 100 pounds on top of the cab which will balance the cab/ counter weights closer to what it should have been at installation. In addition, the APC backup battery was never installed. We saw a box with a brand new battery UPS system sitting on top of the elevator !! It is intended to keep the control energized during a power outage and to return the cab to the first floor.

Anyway it's working now and seems to be reliable....with 50 pounds of weights inside for the time being.
Posted By: Stall Protection

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/27/19 01:10 AM

I think you may have a wonky brake on this one as it should hold the car at the floor even with the slight imbalance. As a mechanic I would want to know for sure if the machine is drifting through the brake or if the ropes are slipping. I would personally remove an elevator from service if I observed it doing that.
Posted By: mjz3348

Re: What elevator do I have? - 11/27/19 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by Stall Protection
I think you may have a wonky brake on this one as it should hold the car at the floor even with the slight imbalance. As a mechanic I would want to know for sure if the machine is drifting through the brake or if the ropes are slipping. I would personally remove an elevator from service if I observed it doing that.


The technician who was here was trying to determine that - but when he stands in the elevator, his weight (big guy) is enough to prevent any observation of the behavior. So we don't know. Adding as little as 50 pounds (dumb bell weights) eliminated the problem. Maybe he needs to take a closer look at the steel cables (ropes) and verify they are tight. That could be it.
© 2024 Elevator Forum