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#10621 - 05/10/14 08:11 AM problem with elevator KONE after change bearings  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
stranger

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
Hello,

I need your urgently support.
We changed bearings of machine type MX10, but now we do not have adjusment elevator. It is show error 117, 113 and 0083. We enters all parameters and "training" elevators, but nothing.
I understand that when we made repair machine we must change resover, but I do not sure this is truth.
Do you know?
Can you help us?

#10626 - 05/10/14 02:12 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 865
jkh Offline
4 Ever Learning.
jkh  Offline
4 Ever Learning.

Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 865
Hello Supervisor,
Please do not take offense, I'm just trying to understand who is asking for our help?
Are you the building supervisor?
Are you in the US?


Make good choices,

JKH
#10627 - 05/10/14 02:29 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: jkh]  
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
rollaway-up Offline
2nd Generation
rollaway-up  Offline
2nd Generation

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
Canada
You changed machine bearings on an mx10???? A bad drive or connection can cause a vibration similar to a bearing, , what kind of drive is it? An mx10 with a resolver?

#10630 - 05/10/14 04:04 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: rollaway-up]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
stranger

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
Jkh "the supervisor" is juct nickname

rollaway-up - I am sure that the elevator has a problem with bearings. Yes machine has resolver. We change bearings and installed in the shaft. The first we have a problem with running on the elevator. When we push button for run-down, the elevator has run-up. Wr clear all parameters and enters again. And when we "training" eleator he run down and next run up and stop.
We think that problem may be in resover, but wr do not sure.

#10640 - 05/11/14 02:02 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
rollaway-up Offline
2nd Generation
rollaway-up  Offline
2nd Generation

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
Canada
Sounds like the motor leads need to be swapped. The tach signals must match the governor encoder. Is this an ecodisc? Are you certain is resolver and not tach?

#10641 - 05/11/14 02:03 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: rollaway-up]  
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
rollaway-up Offline
2nd Generation
rollaway-up  Offline
2nd Generation

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
Canada
Where are you from?

#10645 - 05/11/14 09:27 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: rollaway-up]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
We checked swapped and taho, but we have a problem yet.

#10655 - 05/11/14 10:13 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 116
Elev^te79 Offline
member
Elev^te79  Offline
member

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Posts: 116
That's the second time someone asked you where your from . How about a third ? Where are you from?....... And what type of drive . V3f25 ?

#10656 - 05/11/14 10:15 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 865
jkh Offline
4 Ever Learning.
jkh  Offline
4 Ever Learning.

Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 865
TS,
I'm having trouble following your request. Could we start over?
1) please describe the original trouble you were experiencing. What error codes were you getting?
2) prior to replacing the bearings, did you change any parameters?
3) after you replaced the bearings. What steps did you take to re-commission the elevator back into service?
4) what country was this elevator installed? I ask because I'm under the impression the MX10 was for the US market.

The more information (details) you provide the better.


Make good choices,

JKH
#10658 - 05/12/14 01:43 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: jkh]  
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 451
sbrmilitia Offline
addict
sbrmilitia  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 451
This may be a stupid question but what on earth is a resover?

#10662 - 05/12/14 04:37 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: sbrmilitia]  
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 32
Kone D Offline
newbie
Kone D  Offline
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I have changed bearings on some mx machines before with no problems although I did have a step by step manual from kone elevator along with a tool kit. I also set up resolver from scratch and checked load weighing. Also check your connection on tac and resolver.

#10665 - 05/12/14 11:31 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: Kone D]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
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I am from Bulgaria.
We checked connection on tac, but nothing. I think that if we to have check connection, we to have open machine.

JKH - the machine has very hard noise and we were sure that problem is bearings and when the service opened machine this was right. Next we put the machine with new bearings, but cannot training elevator.

#10703 - 05/14/14 04:31 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
Sorry for confusion, but the situation is very critical for us.
we chech all parameters and boards and we think that problem is resolver and machine.
Do you have instruction or other docunentation and advice?

#10707 - 05/14/14 03:29 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
rollaway-up Offline
2nd Generation
rollaway-up  Offline
2nd Generation

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
Canada
The resolver keeps absolute position of the shaft in relation to the magnets so the drive can give the necessary output.

Check to make sure LEDS TPOL and RPOL are illuminated when driving up, if not it could be polarity of either.

I still think your motor leads are reversed, youll need to get the car to go up when you run up on inspect, than confirm tach/resolver polarity with the leds.

#10708 - 05/14/14 06:00 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: rollaway-up]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
Thank you rollaway-up, but we checked this without result.
Our colleagues tell me that the machine MX10 is not repair and only must be change. I am not sure for this.

#10713 - 05/14/14 07:42 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The staeps we did after we installed the machine :

I.BEFORE we install the ropes :
1.Unplug the cable of the tacho (in the drive ) and check that the value of 6_10 is the same as the one in the drive (-2.704v) - done with no problems
2Unplug the cable of the tacho (in the drive) and switch the jumper S5 (next to the tacho) on 1-2 (test) and manualy rotating the machice to make sure we have correct signal on RPOL - done with no problems
3Plug the cable of the tacho (in the drive) and switch the jumper S5 (next to the tacho) on 2-3(normal) and manualy rotating the machine to make sure we have correct signal on TPOL - done with no problems
4Star menu 6-70 (adjusting resolver angle) and follow the beeping signal (4 beeps - up until it stops and 2 beeps down until stops) until the beeping signal stops and the angle is adjusted and check the angle in menu 6_61 - done with no problems
5We instal the ropes

II AFTER the ropes are installed :

1Start menu 6_70 again and follow the signal until the angle is adjusting and check the angle in the menu 6_61 - we had no problems with that
2.We adjusted LWD - we had no problems with that - now the elevator works correctly on both direction on inspection mode
3We check the speed on the inspection mode in 0.3 - menu 6_21
4We move the car just bellow bottom floor (61N signal is off - 61U,30 and 77N are on) - and start the menu 5_2 - 1(to start learning mode) - The car starts learing mode without problem and start moving up
5After reaching topmost floor the elevator stops - at this point this means the the elevator is ready for normal mode - here we have a problem - At this point the menu shows error 0109 and 0083 and if we leaved still on normal the elevator start to releveling on the floor (61N, 30 and 61U signals on and 77U on).After this point the elevator lost possition and cannot start

The only way to move it is on inspection and do again step 4..We made alot of tests - with magnets, with 61N,61U,30 ,77U and 77N signals, with tacho, we even switch the Drive board and installed it on the other elevator(and the board works correctly on the other elevator) - and we still get the same error once the elevator finish learning mode - 0109 and 0083

#10714 - 05/14/14 08:34 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
rollaway-up Offline
2nd Generation
rollaway-up  Offline
2nd Generation

Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 51
Canada
Ok sounds like you're doing the right things, ill have to think some more.

#10715 - 05/14/14 09:02 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: rollaway-up]  
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
The supervisor Offline
stranger
The supervisor  Offline
stranger

Joined: May 2014
Posts: 24
thank you

#10718 - 05/14/14 09:52 PM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: The supervisor]  
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 865
jkh Offline
4 Ever Learning.
jkh  Offline
4 Ever Learning.

Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 865
TS,
Are you using a written shaft learn procedure from Kone?

I believe 0083 & 0109 error codes indicate your elevator is getting lost during your shaft learn. This could be related to how you are performing the shaft learn.

It's the 113 & 117 error codes that are jumping out at me. I'm not sure but I think they are related to the sequence of your shaft way switches are made.

This has been sitting in the back of my mind since your first post. Is the drive a Yaskawa G5?


Make good choices,

JKH
#10723 - 05/15/14 04:28 AM Re: problem with elevator KONE after change bearings [Re: jkh]  
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 5
greg70 Offline
stranger
greg70  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 5
Australia
Sounds like not accepting learn check motor terminals as I have had that cause not to learn shaft properly

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