TAC50-04 Hall Node

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#21127 - 07/14/17 01:05 AM TAC50-04 Hall Node
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 MSELEVATOR newbie
MSELEVATOR newbie Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 Southeast	I have a four(4) car group with two (2) risers. The top floor hall button on one riser will not activat the down call. The hall lanterns, PI work, The other riser lights both buttons so I pretty sure the node is active/online. DHNF shows all nodes and no faults. But button does not work! Any suggestions. Replacement the hall node but still same problem.

#21128 - 07/14/17 01:30 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: MSELEVATOR]
Joined: May 2013 Posts: 224 Jcjmowrey enthusiast
Jcjmowrey enthusiast Joined: May 2013 Posts: 224 Atlanta ga	I had the same issue on a tac32. I reloaded software off the flash drive in the controller and the problem went away. If all else fails, read the instructions

#21129 - 07/14/17 01:35 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: MSELEVATOR]
Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner
Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Local 18	Well you either have a bad button or you're not getting HCIE to your button. You try putting a jumper across the contact on the button?

#21130 - 07/14/17 02:35 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Indirtwetrust]
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 MSELEVATOR newbie
MSELEVATOR newbie Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 Southeast	I have jumped it, the button actually lights, but does not activate IO. I will try reloading software.

#21131 - 07/14/17 12:55 PM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: MSELEVATOR]
Joined: Jan 2014 Posts: 736 Rolly old hand
Rolly old hand Joined: Jan 2014 Posts: 736	Does it light with I/O Injection on IMS???

#21144 - 07/15/17 07:14 PM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Rolly]
Joined: Jun 2017 Posts: 4 Jm160 Mechanic
Jm160 Mechanic Joined: Jun 2017 Posts: 4 Canada	if you jumped it and the I/o doesn't light then it sounds like your top floor down I/o is in the wrong port/bit or the flat cable going between the breakout card and hn/hnb has a bad connection.

#21156 - 07/17/17 03:54 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Jm160]
Joined: Mar 2015 Posts: 80 Whadafack journeyman
Whadafack journeyman Joined: Mar 2015 Posts: 80	reset and teach it a couple times.

#21173 - 07/19/17 06:09 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Whadafack]
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 MSELEVATOR newbie
MSELEVATOR newbie Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 Southeast	Had to reload job file, ran 5-6 hours then shut down both cars with CAN faults

#21184 - 07/20/17 01:57 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: MSELEVATOR]
Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner
Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Local 18	Have you gone through all the terminations on that CAN channel? Are these 16 or 32 bit controllers? Are there repeaters on the risers? You should read about 2.5vdc from high to ground at the controller and the low should read slightly less like 2.4v. If these are off, replace the CPU, on a 4 car group you need to unplug controllers to see if one is pulling it down.

#21192 - 07/21/17 07:01 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Indirtwetrust]
Joined: Mar 2014 Posts: 212 Silly enthusiast
Silly enthusiast Joined: Mar 2014 Posts: 212	I'm gonna gamble on the resistance load being inaccurate. Tons of jobs got turned over early with improper loads. You should have 60 Ohms on your CAN channels, High to Low (Blue wire with white stripe to white wire with blue stripe). Multi car groups, people often forgot to take off the HC1T and HC1C jumpers. I usually take them off the master car, and all slaves up to my final car, which stays on. If repeaters are used, I sometimes take the jumper off the A channel to get loading correct. Remember it's supposed to be an End Of Line resistor when you leave something on, so make sure it's actually the end of the line. 90% of my odd, intermittent, hard as hell to duplicate, CAN issues have been due to piss poor CAN loading.

#21199 - 07/21/17 11:04 PM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Silly]
Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner
Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Local 18	Originally Posted By: Silly I'm gonna gamble on the resistance load being inaccurate. Tons of jobs got turned over early with improper loads. You should have 60 Ohms on your CAN channels, High to Low (Blue wire with white stripe to white wire with blue stripe). Multi car groups, people often forgot to take off the HC1T and HC1C jumpers. I usually take them off the master car, and all slaves up to my final car, which stays on. If repeaters are used, I sometimes take the jumper off the A channel to get loading correct. Remember it's supposed to be an End Of Line resistor when you leave something on, so make sure it's actually the end of the line. 90% of my odd, intermittent, hard as hell to duplicate, CAN issues have been due to piss poor CAN loading. Absolutely! And don't think because it has been like that for a year, 2 or whatever it must be right. I just found one last week that was one of the first 32 bit 50-04s, the car channel had loading resistors on the CPU, the machine room CNA, the car CNA, and both door operators! Worked fine until now. Also important to remember that just because you have 60 ohms does not mean it's loaded correctly. Better to think of it like you should have 120 ohms of termination resistance on each end. Kind of what you just said.

#21227 - 07/25/17 03:32 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Indirtwetrust]
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 MSELEVATOR newbie
MSELEVATOR newbie Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 Southeast	The CPU will not boot up at all now, can't buy 16bit IOC boards(obsolete), so going to try new Micro tomorrow, with existing IOC board. Will check the resistance, and termination resistors. Keep you posted. Thanks for input.

#21276 - 08/03/17 05:23 PM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: MSELEVATOR]
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 MSELEVATOR newbie
MSELEVATOR newbie Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 Southeast	We have installed 1 of 4 32bit(cpua) processors & IOC boards. The car that was down is now running as a simplex and the other two (2) cars as a duplex on the other riser. Car 3 (slave) was running on the new processor but we turned it off to connect the group wiring to the other car and the I/O board (S24-2) started giving false IO status. So it now is shut down on "safeties": I have a few questions: 1. The New 32bit CPUA, should the terminating jumpers be on car can? I have 60ohms with wires plugged in and 120 with removed on the wires going to CWIC, and 120 on IOC pins. 2. The voltage on can channels are 2.9VDC and 2.65VDC

#21278 - 08/04/17 12:17 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: MSELEVATOR]
Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner
Indirtwetrust ElevatorPractitioner Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 1,535 Local 18	1. That is exactly right, terminations on CPUA and CWI only. 2. That sounds really high, that's from a brand new CPUA? I have replaced CPUA cards for less variation than that (and solved the problem.). Now I'm curious what a good CPUA would measure without anything plugged in at all. 3. So you couldn't get a 16 bit CPU from Thyssen? Obsolete? Did they cut a deal on the 32 bit upgrade? I have never done it myself although I pushed really hard for it on a job with way too many I/Os for 16 bit. I think they offered to supply the hardware.

#21279 - 08/04/17 12:28 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Indirtwetrust]
Joined: Jun 2017 Posts: 4 Jm160 Mechanic
Jm160 Mechanic Joined: Jun 2017 Posts: 4 Canada	With power off and CCH unplugged from controller you should read 60 ohms plus or minus 5 ohms. If not then there are termination resistors on door operator boards, load weighers and on cartop boards that can be removed or on 32 bit CPUA there are shunt jumpers that can be removed for the different cab channels car hall and local I believe.

#21317 - 08/09/17 02:27 AM Re: TAC50-04 Hall Node [Re: Jm160]
Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 MSELEVATOR newbie
MSELEVATOR newbie Joined: Jul 2012 Posts: 26 Southeast	Well to close out the call, all four (4) 32bit processors and IOC are up and running. If you attempt this you must have the CPUA (32bit) manual, which did not come with boards and software. Thanks for all the help!

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