Vatorgator You have some good old fashion troubleshooting to do here. We have dug into similar duplex shorting problems but never with the same outcome as yours witch is as bad as it can get running with doors open. Opening your feeds to 311-312-511-512 and see if the problem goes away. Always try and cut things in half till you loose your problem. Disconnect T cable wires and check again. Older Westinghouse are very bad about diodes shorting when they go bad vs opening up. Does the short or ground only occur with a relay picked or dropped or is it there all the time. You will need to get permission to come in at night for this one Im afraid unless you can have both cars down during the day. We have had to cut the wires between each row of relays once you determine the feed you are after. Normally the brown wire if I remember correctly. Again cut thing in half and see where you lose the problem. Take the time to do a good visual check front and back to see if something looks out of place like the ladder you found. Especially where relays have been replaced I have seen a wire soldered back into the wrong spot that drove 3 mechanics crazy for a week. I have also seen where the Bakelite spacers between the stationary contacts on the NA NB relays had burnt and turned to charcoal and short 3 sets of contacts together. Everything looked fine till you poked your meter lead right into the Bakelite!!!!