greatness has been achieved --lol the elevator is now back in service -it took me 2 complete mc and bk relays -1 bk module -4 new motor brushes which the armature lead was actually resting on the armature as it was spinning --yikes that could have been bad -lucky find changing brushes --but the key to this success was on the main drive contactor -the two auxilary contacts on the side of the main contactor were the culprit ---THANK YOU ALL for the suggestions --I'm sure I will be back for the next nightmare that drives me nuts --to each and every one of my elevator brothers out there -take care of yourselfs and most of all work safely --until next time thanks again